Archie Comics Fan Forum

Everything Archie => All About Archie => Topic started by: terrence12 on August 09, 2017, 02:14:45 AM

Title: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 09, 2017, 02:14:45 AM
I got some news from CBR.com that Archie comics is about to launch Betty and Veronica Vixens another archie alternate universe spinoff starring Betty and Veronica where it takes place in another world where Betty and Veronica are biker girls taking on every bad biker gang and pays homage to the Biker girl movies from the  late 60's to the 70's and also the female equivalent of the Sons of Anarchy and will revive The Mighty Crusaders where it will involve the Dark circle version of the mighty crusaders. You can check out the news source from this link right here: http://www.cbr.com/archie-superhero-team-betty-veronica-biker (http://www.cbr.com/archie-superhero-team-betty-veronica-biker)s/


But still seeing with these upcoming releases ,I think I am going to guess what these two new titles are used for, I think Betty and Veronica Vixens will be used for the newly Rebranded Archie Action where it involves the action version of the Archie characters as Superheroes like 'Pureheart and the superteens' and Spies like The Man from R.I.V.E.R.D.A.L.E Because unlike the alternate horror spinoffs which is Archie Horror/Madhouse like Afterlife with Archie, Chilling Adventures of Sabrina and Jughead The hunger. Vixens would pay tribute to the Action Biker gang films from the 60's and 70's and will help to rebrand Archie:Action since it no longer has the long running Sonic the Hedgehog comics.

And with the upcoming revival of The mighty Crusaders with the Dark Circle Characters,I think that the series will return the brand to its light tone but is still aimed for the Teen Audience since Superheroes comics are for Teens only and will probably rebrand Dark Circle as Red Circle so that it can follow the process DC and MARVEL did with Rebirth and LEGACY.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 09, 2017, 09:56:27 AM
The Mighty Crusaders is written by Ian Flynn, so there's some hope there that it might follow in the same vein as his New Crusaders: Rise of the Heroes miniseries.

I'm surprised you didn't mention the rebooted COSMO, since that's the only title they specifically mentioned as being an Archie Action title.

I doubt that Betty & Veronica VIXENS will be anything like Sons of Anarchy, but we'll see I guess.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: Vegan Jughead on August 09, 2017, 01:09:56 PM
The only one of these I'm REMOTELY interested in is B&V Vixens but I'm only committing to one issue and hope it's better than the concept sounds. 


This might be a bridge too far for me.  Call me old fashioned but biker chicks disgust me and thinking of Betty as some kind of edgy biker (or Veronica for that matter) is disturbing. 


I've been pretty supportive of all the reboots up to now.  I'm hoping this one surprises me, but this might be the first Archie reboot I don't subscribe to. 
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 09, 2017, 01:15:56 PM

The Mighty Crusaders is written by Ian Flynn, so there's some hope there that it might follow in the same vein as his New Crusaders: Rise of the Heroes miniseries.


Yeah,I hope so too.I hope the series will go for a light tone but aimed for a teen audience and let Dark circle rebrand as Red circle.


I'm surprised you didn't mention the rebooted COSMO, since that's the only title they specifically mentioned as being an Archie Action title.


Actually COSMO hasn't been announced yet or greenlighted


I doubt that Betty & Veronica VIXENS will be anything like Sons of Anarchy, but we'll see I guess.

Yeah,Besides Sons of Anarchy has biker genre. So maybe VIXENS will do the same thing except it probably pays more homage to the Biker films from the late 60's to 70s


The only one of these I'm REMOTELY interested in is B&V Vixens but I'm only committing to one issue and hope it's better than the concept sounds. 

I hope so too


This might be a bridge too far for me.  Call me old fashioned but biker chicks disgust me and thinking of Betty as some kind of edgy biker (or Veronica for that matter) is disturbing.

You might have a good point there   

I've been pretty supportive of all the reboots up to now.  I'm hoping this one surprises me, but this might be the first Archie reboot I don't subscribe to.

Maybe
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 09, 2017, 06:54:57 PM
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I'm surprised you didn't mention the rebooted COSMO, since that's the only title they specifically mentioned as being an Archie Action title.


Actually COSMO hasn't been announced yet or greenlighted

(https://www.archiefans.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hollywoodreporter.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Fcustom%2FGraeme%2FArchieGoldwater%2FArchie-Cosmo.jpg&hash=b0cba22c8e29a0018b6e0db29c8eeb13)
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/archie-comics-ceo-taking-risks-classic-characters-future-riverdale-1027516?utm_source=twitter&utm_source=Direct (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/archie-comics-ceo-taking-risks-classic-characters-future-riverdale-1027516?utm_source=twitter&utm_source=Direct)

THAT sure sounded like an announcement to me... plus the confirmation that Sonic is moving to IDW.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 09, 2017, 07:47:55 PM

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I doubt that Betty & Veronica VIXENS will be anything like Sons of Anarchy, but we'll see I guess.

Yeah,Besides Sons of Anarchy has biker genre. So maybe VIXENS will do the same thing except it probably pays more homage to the Biker films from the late 60's to 70s

Maybe it's me, but trying to read between the lines there I didn't get the slightest impression that VIXENS was going to be a "MR" title, so probably no sex and drugs, or anything R-rated there, I think. More like some fantasy B&V 'girls gone wild' thing, while remaining all-ages, like the New Riverdale titles. Who knows, maybe we'll see Nick St. Clair again?  ::)

The only one of these I'm REMOTELY interested in is B&V Vixens but I'm only committing to one issue and hope it's better than the concept sounds. 

This might be a bridge too far for me.  Call me old fashioned but biker chicks disgust me and thinking of Betty as some kind of edgy biker (or Veronica for that matter) is disturbing. 

I've been pretty supportive of all the reboots up to now.  I'm hoping this one surprises me, but this might be the first Archie reboot I don't subscribe to.

Keep in mind that it's written and drawn by women, VJ. I very much doubt you're going to see B&V portrayed in the more realistic vein of the outlaw biker women on Sons of Anarchy, or the stereotypical biker chicks of the 1968-1972 R-rated biker exploitation movies. They won't be drinking beer, smoking pot, seeing which one can amass the biggest collection of tattoos, and having random sex off-panel with hunky biker dudes.

I imagine this will be more like a girly girlpower schoolgirl fantasy of... "Hey, did you ever imagine what it would be like if we were badass biker babes? Vroom! VaROOM!!"  "Oh wow, I wonder what THAT would be like...?" [...Cue harpstring chorus and wavy-gravy dissolve to the dream sequence.]  ...But if they're smart they'll realize that the title can't survive with only female readers, so they'll try to make sure it has some appeal to male readers as well.

I don't think this will be any more of an "action" title than the recently rebooted Josie and the Pussycats. I don't expect the kind of Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa written/David Lynch-inspired "dark underbelly" take of an Afterlife With Archie. Veronica will still be picking out her designer original biker leathers from Paris, and Betty will still be stopping to help a little girl find her stray cat.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: Vegan Jughead on August 10, 2017, 06:46:26 AM


I doubt that Betty & Veronica VIXENS will be anything like Sons of Anarchy, but we'll see I guess.

Yeah,Besides Sons of Anarchy has biker genre. So maybe VIXENS will do the same thing except it probably pays more homage to the Biker films from the late 60's to 70s

Maybe it's me, but trying to read between the lines there I didn't get the slightest impression that VIXENS was going to be a "MR" title, so probably no sex and drugs, or anything R-rated there, I think. More like some fantasy B&V 'girls gone wild' thing, while remaining all-ages, like the New Riverdale titles. Who knows, maybe we'll see Nick St. Clair again?  ::)

The only one of these I'm REMOTELY interested in is B&V Vixens but I'm only committing to one issue and hope it's better than the concept sounds. 

This might be a bridge too far for me.  Call me old fashioned but biker chicks disgust me and thinking of Betty as some kind of edgy biker (or Veronica for that matter) is disturbing. 

I've been pretty supportive of all the reboots up to now.  I'm hoping this one surprises me, but this might be the first Archie reboot I don't subscribe to.

Keep in mind that it's written and drawn by women, VJ. I very much doubt you're going to see B&V portrayed in the more realistic vein of the outlaw biker women on Sons of Anarchy, or the stereotypical biker chicks of the 1968-1972 R-rated biker exploitation movies. They won't be drinking beer, smoking pot, seeing which one can amass the biggest collection of tattoos, and having random sex off-panel with hunky biker dudes.

I imagine this will be more like a girly girlpower schoolgirl fantasy of... "Hey, did you ever imagine what it would be like if we were badass biker babes? Vroom! VaROOM!!"  "Oh wow, I wonder what THAT would be like...?" [...Cue harpstring chorus and wavy-gravy dissolve to the dream sequence.]  ...But if they're smart they'll realize that the title can't survive with only female readers, so they'll try to make sure it has some appeal to male readers as well.

I don't think this will be any more of an "action" title than the recently rebooted Josie and the Pussycats. I don't expect the kind of Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa written/David Lynch-inspired "dark underbelly" take of an Afterlife With Archie. Veronica will still be picking out her designer original biker leathers from Paris, and Betty will still be stopping to help a little girl find her stray cat.


Maybe you should write it.  That doesn't seem as bad as what I'm fearing.  Still, biker chicks are gross, something I've never said about B&V. 
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 10, 2017, 07:24:49 AM


I doubt that Betty & Veronica VIXENS will be anything like Sons of Anarchy, but we'll see I guess.

Yeah,Besides Sons of Anarchy has biker genre. So maybe VIXENS will do the same thing except it probably pays more homage to the Biker films from the late 60's to 70s

Maybe it's me, but trying to read between the lines there I didn't get the slightest impression that VIXENS was going to be a "MR" title, so probably no sex and drugs, or anything R-rated there, I think. More like some fantasy B&V 'girls gone wild' thing, while remaining all-ages, like the New Riverdale titles. Who knows, maybe we'll see Nick St. Clair again?  ::)

The only one of these I'm REMOTELY interested in is B&V Vixens but I'm only committing to one issue and hope it's better than the concept sounds. 

This might be a bridge too far for me.  Call me old fashioned but biker chicks disgust me and thinking of Betty as some kind of edgy biker (or Veronica for that matter) is disturbing. 

I've been pretty supportive of all the reboots up to now.  I'm hoping this one surprises me, but this might be the first Archie reboot I don't subscribe to.

Keep in mind that it's written and drawn by women, VJ. I very much doubt you're going to see B&V portrayed in the more realistic vein of the outlaw biker women on Sons of Anarchy, or the stereotypical biker chicks of the 1968-1972 R-rated biker exploitation movies. They won't be drinking beer, smoking pot, seeing which one can amass the biggest collection of tattoos, and having random sex off-panel with hunky biker dudes.

I imagine this will be more like a girly girlpower schoolgirl fantasy of... "Hey, did you ever imagine what it would be like if we were badass biker babes? Vroom! VaROOM!!"  "Oh wow, I wonder what THAT would be like...?" [...Cue harpstring chorus and wavy-gravy dissolve to the dream sequence.]  ...But if they're smart they'll realize that the title can't survive with only female readers, so they'll try to make sure it has some appeal to male readers as well.

I don't think this will be any more of an "action" title than the recently rebooted Josie and the Pussycats. I don't expect the kind of Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa written/David Lynch-inspired "dark underbelly" take of an Afterlife With Archie. Veronica will still be picking out her designer original biker leathers from Paris, and Betty will still be stopping to help a little girl find her stray cat.


Maybe you should write it.  That doesn't seem as bad as what I'm fearing.  Still, biker chicks are gross, something I've never said about B&V.

I just don't see where you're getting a heebie-jeebie vibe from THIS cover (drawn by the actual interior artist), Vegan. This looks sort of quaint, almost like those fairy-tale covers.

(https://www.archiefans.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn2.thr.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Fimagecache%2FNFE_portrait%2F2017%2F08%2Fbettyandveronicavixens1-p_2017.jpg&hash=82d565c4a66141c7a62d8997c53d5d68)
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: Vegan Jughead on August 10, 2017, 08:05:51 AM


I doubt that Betty & Veronica VIXENS will be anything like Sons of Anarchy, but we'll see I guess.

Yeah,Besides Sons of Anarchy has biker genre. So maybe VIXENS will do the same thing except it probably pays more homage to the Biker films from the late 60's to 70s

Maybe it's me, but trying to read between the lines there I didn't get the slightest impression that VIXENS was going to be a "MR" title, so probably no sex and drugs, or anything R-rated there, I think. More like some fantasy B&V 'girls gone wild' thing, while remaining all-ages, like the New Riverdale titles. Who knows, maybe we'll see Nick St. Clair again?  ::)

The only one of these I'm REMOTELY interested in is B&V Vixens but I'm only committing to one issue and hope it's better than the concept sounds. 

This might be a bridge too far for me.  Call me old fashioned but biker chicks disgust me and thinking of Betty as some kind of edgy biker (or Veronica for that matter) is disturbing. 

I've been pretty supportive of all the reboots up to now.  I'm hoping this one surprises me, but this might be the first Archie reboot I don't subscribe to.

Keep in mind that it's written and drawn by women, VJ. I very much doubt you're going to see B&V portrayed in the more realistic vein of the outlaw biker women on Sons of Anarchy, or the stereotypical biker chicks of the 1968-1972 R-rated biker exploitation movies. They won't be drinking beer, smoking pot, seeing which one can amass the biggest collection of tattoos, and having random sex off-panel with hunky biker dudes.

I imagine this will be more like a girly girlpower schoolgirl fantasy of... "Hey, did you ever imagine what it would be like if we were badass biker babes? Vroom! VaROOM!!"  "Oh wow, I wonder what THAT would be like...?" [...Cue harpstring chorus and wavy-gravy dissolve to the dream sequence.]  ...But if they're smart they'll realize that the title can't survive with only female readers, so they'll try to make sure it has some appeal to male readers as well.

I don't think this will be any more of an "action" title than the recently rebooted Josie and the Pussycats. I don't expect the kind of Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa written/David Lynch-inspired "dark underbelly" take of an Afterlife With Archie. Veronica will still be picking out her designer original biker leathers from Paris, and Betty will still be stopping to help a little girl find her stray cat.


Maybe you should write it.  That doesn't seem as bad as what I'm fearing.  Still, biker chicks are gross, something I've never said about B&V.

I just don't see where you're getting a heebie-jeebie vibe from THIS cover (drawn by the actual interior artist), Vegan. This looks sort of quaint, almost like those fairy-tale covers.

(https://www.archiefans.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn2.thr.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Fimagecache%2FNFE_portrait%2F2017%2F08%2Fbettyandveronicavixens1-p_2017.jpg&hash=82d565c4a66141c7a62d8997c53d5d68)
I don't know what it is, either, DCR.  I just don't like it.  Like I said, I'll give the first issue a try. I'll give ANY Archie Comics title a try (except Dark Circle; that's just too far outside my world), and I'm going to try to be open minded, but I even like Adam Hughes' take on B&V much better than this and I wasn't really fond of that either.  I'm hoping this is temporary and we can get a Your Pal Archie style Betty and Veronica before much longer.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 10, 2017, 08:18:57 AM
I'm surprised you didn't mention the rebooted COSMO, since that's the only title they specifically mentioned as being an Archie Action title.

Actually COSMO hasn't been announced yet or greenlighted

(https://www.archiefans.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hollywoodreporter.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Fcustom%2FGraeme%2FArchieGoldwater%2FArchie-Cosmo.jpg&hash=b0cba22c8e29a0018b6e0db29c8eeb13)
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/archie-comics-ceo-taking-risks-classic-characters-future-riverdale-1027516?utm_source=twitter&utm_source=Direct (http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/archie-comics-ceo-taking-risks-classic-characters-future-riverdale-1027516?utm_source=twitter&utm_source=Direct)

THAT sure sounded like an announcement to me... plus the confirmation that Sonic is moving to IDW.

Woah! You're not kidding ,Archie comics is about to revive COSMO but still with SONIC no longer part of the Archie comics and that the upcoming revived COSMO is too childish with those designs,I think maybe Archie Comics should make  all ages line for the revived COSMO (instead of Archie Action) along with Art Baltazar's Little Archie if it turned into a full series

Keep in mind that it's written and drawn by women, VJ. I very much doubt you're going to see B&V portrayed in the more realistic vein of the outlaw biker women on Sons of Anarchy, or the stereotypical biker chicks of the 1968-1972 R-rated biker exploitation movies. They won't be drinking beer, smoking pot, seeing which one can amass the biggest collection of tattoos, and having random sex off-panel with hunky biker dudes.I imagine this will be more like a girly girlpower schoolgirl fantasy of... "Hey, did you ever imagine what it would be like if we were badass biker babes? Vroom! VaROOM!!"  "Oh wow, I wonder what THAT would be like...?" [...Cue harpstring chorus and wavy-gravy dissolve to the dream sequence.]  ...But if they're smart they'll realize that the title can't survive with only female readers, so they'll try to make sure it has some appeal to male readers as well.I don't think this will be any more of an "action" title than the recently rebooted Josie and the Pussycats. I don't expect the kind of Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa written/David Lynch-inspired "dark underbelly" take of an Afterlife With Archie. Veronica will still be picking out her designer original biker leathers from Paris, and Betty will still be stopping to help a little girl find her stray cat.







Maybe but as for the reboot of Josie and the Pussycats I think that this comic is part of the main and that VIXENS is probably an alternate take on Betty and Veronica as bikers in some different brand of Archie probably Action or something else


I just don't see where you're getting a heebie-jeebie vibe from THIS cover (drawn by the actual interior artist), Vegan. This looks sort of quaint, almost like those fairy-tale covers.


It's still the alternate take of Betty and Veronica as Bikers.


Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 10, 2017, 08:47:51 AM
Hey, everything they've been publishing (except the digest stories) since mid-2015 has been an "alternate take" as far as I'm concerned. And before that, Afterlife With Archie. And before THAT, Life With Archie, and before THAT, "New Look Archie" and "Manga Sabrina".
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 10, 2017, 09:52:11 AM
Still, biker chicks are gross, something I've never said about B&V.

Zombies and werewolves are gross, but I didn't read you raising a stink about it when they turned Jughead into one of them. Maybe you're just saving up your outrage for when they turn him into a surfer dude?

I have no interest in reading "Jughead is a werewolf". Stupidest idea ever. Unless there turns out to be more to it than just that. Like if his future time-travelling self had to hunt down his past werewolf-self by chasing him throughout history or something. Probably still pointless though, since it would be obvious he's already succeeded (think about it).

My point is, on a relative scale? Oh, in this series B&V ride motorcycles. Big whoop, I'm appalled. A drop in the bucket compared to any of a half-dozen plot twists Aguirre-Sacasa has served up on a platter. That's just the TV show, not AWA.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 10, 2017, 10:10:47 AM
Hey, everything they've been publishing (except the digest stories) since mid-2015 has been an "alternate take" as far as I'm concerned. And before that, Afterlife With Archie. And before THAT, Life With Archie, and before THAT, "New Look Archie" and "Manga Sabrina".




Ok,Ok so most of the brand stories except the main one are  alternate takes of the characters.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 10, 2017, 02:56:08 PM
Hey, everything they've been publishing (except the digest stories) since mid-2015 has been an "alternate take" as far as I'm concerned. And before that, Afterlife With Archie. And before THAT, Life With Archie, and before THAT, "New Look Archie" and "Manga Sabrina".




Ok,Ok so most of the brand stories except the main one are  alternate takes of the characters.

You still failed to grasp my point, terrence. What you are calling "the main one" IS an alternate take, no different than the rest of those I mentioned (and the many others I failed to mention). If it's not "classic Archie", then by definition it's "an alternate take". And at its current longevity of 22 issues, it still has a long way to go to beat the previous alternate take record-holder (Life With Archie magazine).

That's not to say I dislike all alternate takes. There are plenty of them "in the classic Archie style" (as they used to say in the ads for the digests)... Pureheart the Powerful (& friends), Jughead's Time Police, Archie 1, Archie 3000!, Archie's Weird Mysteries, Agents B&V, Archie's Explorers of the Unknown, Jughead Jones Semi-Private Eye, Betty & Veronica's Storybook, Archie Cyber Adventures, Betty Cooper Super-Sleuther, etc.

Before the appearance of Your Pal Archie #1, ACP had completely ceased publishing any "regular, non-alternate" Archie comic books in the floppy comics format for two years, while the new 5-page "regular" stories in the digests continued on.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: Vegan Jughead on August 10, 2017, 05:29:46 PM
Still, biker chicks are gross, something I've never said about B&V.

Zombies and werewolves are gross, but I didn't read you raising a stink about it when they turned Jughead into one of them. Maybe you're just saving up your outrage for when they turn him into a surfer dude?

I have no interest in reading "Jughead is a werewolf". Stupidest idea ever. Unless there turns out to be more to it than just that. Like if his future time-travelling self had to hunt down his past werewolf-self by chasing him throughout history or something. Probably still pointless though, since it would be obvious he's already succeeded (think about it).

My point is, on a relative scale? Oh, in this series B&V ride motorcycles. Big whoop, I'm appalled. A drop in the bucket compared to any of a half-dozen plot twists Aguirre-Sacasa has served up on a platter. That's just the TV show, not AWA.


I agree zombies and werewolves are gross but not AS gross as chicks dressed like bikers in my opinion.  I want to stress that I'm a hardcore feminist and believe women who want to be bikers should do so.  I'm only stating a personal preference when it comes to what art I want to look at.  I have a certain image of Betty and Veronica and that's what I prefer.  It's not that I think it's WRONG that they're making them bikers, it just turns me completely off.   BUT as I said, I'll give issue one a try and if the writing is great, I'm sure I can deal with the image.  It will just have to be REALLY great. 


As far as Jughead: The Hunger, I enjoyed the one shot moderately.  I'm hoping for better things now that they're committing to an ongoing.  I agree it will be too one note if that's the whole gist. 
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 10, 2017, 08:39:21 PM
Hey, everything they've been publishing (except the digest stories) since mid-2015 has been an "alternate take" as far as I'm concerned. And before that, Afterlife With Archie. And before THAT, Life With Archie, and before THAT, "New Look Archie" and "Manga Sabrina".




Ok,Ok so most of the brand stories except the main one are  alternate takes of the characters.

You still failed to grasp my point, terrence. What you are calling "the main one" IS an alternate take, no different than the rest of those I mentioned (and the many others I failed to mention). If it's not "classic Archie", then by definition it's "an alternate take". And at its current longevity of 22 issues, it still has a long way to go to beat the previous alternate take record-holder (Life With Archie magazine).

That's not to say I dislike all alternate takes. There are plenty of them "in the classic Archie style" (as they used to say in the ads for the digests)... Pureheart the Powerful (& friends), Jughead's Time Police, Archie 1, Archie 3000!, Archie's Weird Mysteries, Agents B&V, Archie's Explorers of the Unknown, Jughead Jones Semi-Private Eye, Betty & Veronica's Storybook, Archie Cyber Adventures, Betty Cooper Super-Sleuther, etc.

Before the appearance of Your Pal Archie #1, ACP had completely ceased publishing any "regular, non-alternate" Archie comic books in the floppy comics format for two years, while the new 5-page "regular" stories in the digests continued on.


Sorry,I was just understanding and you have a good point most publications of Archie comics are alternate versions of the main characters
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 11, 2017, 02:24:36 AM
I agree zombies and werewolves are gross but not AS gross as chicks dressed like bikers in my opinion.  I want to stress that I'm a hardcore feminist and believe women who want to be bikers should do so.  I'm only stating a personal preference when it comes to what art I want to look at.  I have a certain image of Betty and Veronica and that's what I prefer.  It's not that I think it's WRONG that they're making them bikers, it just turns me completely off.   BUT as I said, I'll give issue one a try and if the writing is great, I'm sure I can deal with the image.  It will just have to be REALLY great. 

It will be interesting to see whether this turns out to be Betty & Veronica "dressed like" bikers, or Betty & Veronica AS bikers. There's a huge gap between those two to me. Not all bikers are the same, but as long as they remain Betty & Veronica (as I understand them), and there's some sense of humor to it, I'll be happy with it. Adam Hughes' version did not meet those requirements for me.

Can they be convincing (in whatever context they're using, which may turn out to be more fantasy than reality) as bikers, and still BE Betty & Veronica? That's what I'm interested in finding out. I suspect that a little TOO much reality here could torpedo the whole idea, because it would force the characters to change to fit the situation. If it turns out that the Vixens in the story are merely lookalikes for B&V, and aren't really those characters at all, as they've been previously established, I'll drop it like a hot potato.

Normally I'd find a female who doesn't bathe and wallows around in filthy mud with a bunch of pigs to be a turnoff to me personally (in real life), but you know what? In comics, Moonbeam McSwine really made that look work for her.

(https://www.archiefans.com/index.php?media/file/moonbeam-mcswine.3522/)
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 11, 2017, 05:30:39 AM

It will be interesting to see whether this turns out to be Betty & Veronica "dressed like" bikers, or Betty & Veronica AS bikers. There's a huge gap between those two to me. Not all bikers are the same, but as long as they remain Betty & Veronica (as I understand them), and there's some sense of humor to it, I'll be happy with it. Adam Hughes' version did not meet those requirements for me.


I think it will be the later as this will take place in the world where Betty and veronica are bikers but they will still be betty and veronica


Can they be convincing (in whatever context they're using, which may turn out to be more fantasy than reality) as bikers, and still BE Betty & Veronica? That's what I'm interested in finding out. I suspect that a little TOO much reality here could torpedo the whole idea, because it would force the characters to change to fit the situation. If it turns out that the Vixens in the story are merely lookalikes for B&V, and aren't really those characters at all, as they've been previously established, I'll drop it like a hot potato.


Well since the vixens series takes place in the world where betty and veronica are bikers ,I think they will change but they will always be betty and veronica


Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: irishmoxie on August 11, 2017, 02:12:24 PM
Why oh why can't they make a Betty and Veronica series marketed towards women?
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: Vegan Jughead on August 11, 2017, 03:35:33 PM
Why oh why can't they make a Betty and Veronica series marketed towards women?


I agree.  Even though I'm male, my taste runs more toward what women read, especially in comics. 
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 11, 2017, 09:16:22 PM
Why oh why can't they make a Betty and Veronica series marketed towards women?


You know,That's a good question.Why Archie couldn't make some betty and Veronica comics aimed at women,Even though the times are changing that people can read whatever they like gender or not.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 12, 2017, 12:46:37 AM
Why oh why can't they make a Betty and Veronica series marketed towards women?


You know,That's a good question.Why Archie couldn't make some betty and Veronica comics aimed at women,Even though the times are changing that people can read whatever they like gender or not.

VIXENS is written by a woman (Jamie Rotante), and drawn by a woman (Eva Cabrera). Why would you think it wouldn't be marketed towards women? If the concept doesn't float your boat at all, then perhaps you should discuss the topic of why all women don't like the same type of comics with Jamie Rotante, whose idea it was. It would be a mistaken assumption to think that all women just naturally like the same comics that you do. Do you think all men like exactly the same type of comics? The biggest thing I think you're missing here is that ALL comics combined have such a tiny audience relatively speaking, compared to television and movies. MOST people have no interest in comics whatsoever, whether they are male or female, but historically, far fewer women have adopted the the habit of reading those traditional floppy comic books. Many may feel such a stigma towards the format that they wouldn't even consider touching them, while they may not necessarily feel the same about a graphic novel or a manga paperback. But that's assuming they've been exposed to comics in that format to begin with, which is by no means a given. These aren't always so obvious considerations to female readers of digital format comics, because they just assume anyone could get them, so what's the problem? I think it's more a question of "But why would they want to in the first place?" If you assume there's nothing of interest to you there, then you're not looking -- but publishers can't sell female-oriented titles to a potential audience that isn't even looking.

But if you want a real answer to your question in general, just look at all the attempts Marvel (especially) has made to market comics written and drawn by women, featuring female protagonists. There just aren't enough women readers reading comics in the floppy format, that mainly have to be purchased from a comic book store, to support a title all by themselves. If the title doesn't also appeal to male readers as well, then it's certainly doomed to be cancelled right from the start. That may work fine for manga paperbacks, but that's because both the economics and the distribution are entirely different.

Let's take a look at that cover again... (this is the main cover, with artwork by interior artist Eva Cabrera).

(https://www.archiefans.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn2.thr.com%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Fimagecache%2FNFE_portrait%2F2017%2F08%2Fbettyandveronicavixens1-p_2017.jpg&hash=82d565c4a66141c7a62d8997c53d5d68)

Maybe I'm a little dense here, but could you tell me, specifically, what it is about that cover image that seems to you like it's obviously appealing to a male reader, as opposed to a female one? Because I can easily think of at least a half-dozen things about that design that are dead wrong in terms of M-appeal.

Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 12, 2017, 01:37:56 AM
Why oh why can't they make a Betty and Veronica series marketed towards women?


You know,That's a good question.Why Archie couldn't make some betty and Veronica comics aimed at women,Even though the times are changing that people can read whatever they like gender or not.

VIXENS is written by a woman (Jamie Rotante), and drawn by a woman (Eva Cabrera). Why would you think it wouldn't be marketed towards women? If the concept doesn't float your boat at all, then perhaps you should discuss the topic of why all women don't like the same type of comics with Jamie Rotante, whose idea it was. It would be a mistaken assumption to think that all women just naturally like the same comics that you do. Do you think all men like exactly the same type of comics? The biggest thing I think you're missing here is that ALL comics combined have such a tiny audience relatively speaking, compared to television and movies. MOST people have no interest in comics whatsoever, whether they are male or female, but historically, far fewer women have adopted the the habit of reading those traditional floppy comic books. Many may feel such a stigma towards the format that they wouldn't even consider touching them, while they may not necessarily feel the same about a graphic novel or a manga paperback. But that's assuming they've been exposed to comics in that format to begin with, which is by no means a given. These aren't always so obvious considerations to female readers of digital format comics, because they just assume anyone could get them, so what's the problem? I think it's more a question of "But why would they want to in the first place?" If you assume there's nothing of interest to you there, then you're not looking -- but publishers can't sell female-oriented titles to a potential audience that isn't even looking.

But if you want a real answer to your question in general, just look at all the attempts Marvel (especially) has made to market comics written and drawn by women, featuring female protagonists. There just aren't enough women readers reading comics in the floppy format, that mainly have to be purchased from a comic book store, to support a title all by themselves. If the title doesn't also appeal to male readers as well, then it's certainly doomed to be cancelled right from the start. That may work fine for manga paperbacks, but that's because both the economics and the distribution are entirely different.


I guess that make sense since people can reade what ever books they want to read despite their gender.As for japan they still categorize the shounen (boys),Shojo (girls),Seinen(adult men) and Josei (adult women) in their manga magazines.Maybe  in the future manga will no longer be categorize by genre and gender  but by age instead so that people with different gender can read whatever  manga  they like
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on August 12, 2017, 02:48:30 AM
I don't know for sure, but I'd be surprised to discover that manga collections, when sold in Japanese bookstores, are categorized in any other way than by separating them into their own demographic sections, according to gender and age. "Men's comics", "Women's comics", "Boys' comics", "Girls' comics".

Here in North America, however, manga collections are routinely just alphabetized by title in bookstores.

In comic book shops, floppy comics are all sorted by some combination of alphabetically and/or by major publisher, a with a small minority of "Kids' comics" sequestered off to the safety of their own little island or corner. At least after they've all been moved out of the "This Week's Comics/New Releases" section.

That right there tells you something. Those two consumer bases in two different countries are completely different animals, because the surrounding culture dictates so.
Title: Re: My thoughts on Archie launching B&V Vixens and The Mighty Crusaders revival
Post by: terrence12 on August 12, 2017, 09:02:50 AM
I don't know for sure, but I'd be surprised to discover that manga collections, when sold in Japanese bookstores, are categorized in any other way than by separating them into their own demographic sections, according to gender and age. "Men's comics", "Women's comics", "Boys' comics", "Girls' comics".

Here in North America, however, manga collections are routinely just alphabetized by title in bookstores.

In comic book shops, floppy comics are all sorted by some combination of alphabetically and/or by major publisher, a with a small minority of "Kids' comics" sequestered off to the safety of their own little island or corner. At least after they've all been moved out of the "This Week's Comics/New Releases" section.

That right there tells you something. Those two consumer bases in two different countries are completely different animals, because the surrounding culture dictates so.


You have a good point there