Quote from: Thrillho on June 25, 2016, 12:04:21 PM
What exactly did Veronica do wrong in this story to warrant "being taught a lesson"? She was right Jughead was out to get her through Jellybean.

Furthermore, there is no continuity in the Archie-verse, not even with the same writers. Each story is self-contained and has no bearing on any others. "Beach Blanket Babysitters" was published in 2010 and it didn't acknowledge a 2003 story where Veronica and Jellybean are already close, "Hey Sister."

They're both written by Dan Parent but the second one contradicts the first. They were already friends and liked each other.

All we know in "Beach Blanket Babysitters" is that Jughead influenced Jellybean to be anti-Veronica for no apparent reason other than he wants to mess with her.

I'm sure I have "Beach Blanket Babysitters" in a collection somewhere, but I can't remember where now. And since you didn't post the entire story, I can't remember exactly how it started now or what it was that changed Jellybean's mind about Veronica and made her decide that she was her friend after all. Let's remember here that Jellybean is just a child too, who's just having some innocent fun, and perhaps being a little mischievous as well. Let's not forget the point of the story, which is that Jellybean is capable of making her own choices, and isn't just some kind of puppet for Jughead to use to carry out his will.

As far as continuity is concerned, you're mistaken about there not being ANY between stories in Archie Comics. Sometimes there is, and sometimes there isn't. In most cases where there is, a footnote will alert the reader to the prior story, but just because there isn't a footnote, I don't assume no continuity unless there's a direct contradiction that seems to say otherwise. I'm thinking specifically about a couple of B&V Christmas stories ("Jingles All the Way" and "Holiday Watch") featuring both Jingles (and his human guise of Jimmy) and Sugar Plum (and her human guise as Summer), which appeared almost a year apart and ARE connected (and a footnote tells you so). In the next story in which the two characters appear together, there's no continuity with the prior two stories -- and all of them are by Dan Parent.

I assumed in "Beach Blanket Babysitters" that it was referencing the first story where Veronica basically uses Jellybean for selfish reasons to cast herself in a favorable light as a caring person who loves children (when the opposite is the true case, in reality, in that first story), and that Jellybean was somehow remembering that. I didn't read "Hey Sister" in the order it came out, I read it as a reprint, so I wasn't really sure where it fit vis-a-vis the other two Jellybean/Veronica stories. There's yet another Veronica/Jellybean story involving Mr. Lodge (who turns out to be a collector of valuable old PEZ dispensers, one of which Jellybean takes a fancy to) as well, and I think that's the one I was thinking of as the second story.

Quote from: spazaru on June 25, 2016, 07:08:31 AM

Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 25, 2016, 04:02:37 AM

Quote from: irishmoxie on June 25, 2016, 01:44:17 AM

Quote from: daren on June 25, 2016, 01:10:51 AM
I'm starting to think the delays are on purpose. Roberto said last year he was the holdup and I guess he was right, I thought maybe he was taking the fall so ACP wouldn't look bad but no, they've been putting out their other books on time this past year. Unless the delays are Francesco's, but if they're Roberto's why are they happening at all. Story and dialogue as simple and short as Afterlife's shouldn't take that long to write even if he has other things going on. I'm not saying that means it sucks, even though it is overrated I still like it okay and it's better than Life With Archie which was more complex and ambitious, but you would think LWA would be the book with delays, it must have been harder to write, instead it's Afterlife? I can't think of any reason why that would be unless it IS on purpose.

Logically I would think it would be the artist (Francesco) who would be the cause of delays because it takes longer to draw.

He can't even BEGIN to draw until he gets a script though. Plus he's got to draw other things to in order to earn a living and to pay the rent, and it's hard to schedule his time when he can't know when to expect an AWA script with any regularity. So there is that logic as well.

I agree with Daren, it's not a bad book but it's overrated. Paul Kupperberg had been scripting comics for decades, so despite whatever complicated plot threads had to be woven into LWA, he was a professional who knew how to make a deadline, and didn't have other commitments to television writing, either. For Aguirre-Sacasa, comics comes a distant second to his TV work (that's how HE pays the rent).

It's funny.  Every time I start to think it's overrated, they FINALLY put out a new issue and I start thinking it's the best thing they've published in many years again.

I think the last issue they came out with was probably the best-written one so far. I thought the Sabrina issue (#6?) was above average too (and I sort of wish that Francesco Francavilla was the artist on ChAoS instead of Robert Hack, because in general I like the writing on that book better, but Francavilla's the better artist). I haven't felt that every issue of AWA has been better than the previous one, though.

But mainly it's more like... I never really wanted Archie Comics characters starring in a horror series to begin with, and in general these two books really haven't changed my mind about that. Given what it's attempting to do, it's okay, but I can't really get that enthused about it.

Quote from: Thrillho on June 14, 2016, 01:30:19 PM

Quote from: daren on June 14, 2016, 03:46:24 AM
Maybe she doesn't put up with a LOT more, but, more. In most Archie feuds the villain character IS the offender more (Betty vs. Veronica, Archie vs. Reggie, Jughead vs. Reggie), but with Jughead and Veronica, he does seem to sin against her more than the reverse, I never noticed how much till I started paying attention to these stories.

I agree somewhat. A lot of times he has it in for Veronica because she's treating Betty or Archie unfairly, but you're right, he's more likely start something without provocation than she is.

Here is a good example





And of course, Jughead is behind it all



That's why I think Midge's assessment in "Object of Affection" might be true, that Jughead wants attention from Veronica, at least in Dan Parent's stories, while she's more content to just ignore him.

Ah, but this isn't the first Veronica/Jellybean story, it's the second (or possibly even the third). In the first one, Veronica doesn't like Jellybean because she thinks that she's just like a little Jughead. Nevertheless, it doesn't prevent Veronica from trying to exploit Jellybean's innate cuteness when she tries to babysit her as an excuse to get an "in" with a hunky male nanny that she meets in the park. In that one, Jughead finds out what's going on, and with Jellybean as an accomplice, teaches Veronica a well-deserved lesson.

The above story is kind of sweet, because after Jellybean senses that Veronica has learned her lesson, she only torments her a little bit for good measure -- sort of like the guys busting on each other in camaraderie -- before deciding that she's a good egg after all, and she actually likes her. After that, Jellybean isn't willing to go along with her brother's dirty tricks. Just goes to show Jellybean has a mind of her own.

Quote from: Midge Klump on June 24, 2016, 02:26:34 PM
So Archie Andrews has dated just about every girl in Riverdale and the surrounding counties, but has there ever been a story where he has gone out on a date with Ethel? I don't seem to recall ever reading something like that before.

Yes, there was a story where he took Ethel to the prom. B&V mainly shamed him into it, after the usual bout of indecision over whether he'd ask Betty or Veronica, and they both agreed to sit this prom out in favor of Archie asking Ethel.

Quote from: irishmoxie on June 25, 2016, 01:44:17 AM

Quote from: daren on June 25, 2016, 01:10:51 AM
I'm starting to think the delays are on purpose. Roberto said last year he was the holdup and I guess he was right, I thought maybe he was taking the fall so ACP wouldn't look bad but no, they've been putting out their other books on time this past year. Unless the delays are Francesco's, but if they're Roberto's why are they happening at all. Story and dialogue as simple and short as Afterlife's shouldn't take that long to write even if he has other things going on. I'm not saying that means it sucks, even though it is overrated I still like it okay and it's better than Life With Archie which was more complex and ambitious, but you would think LWA would be the book with delays, it must have been harder to write, instead it's Afterlife? I can't think of any reason why that would be unless it IS on purpose.

Logically I would think it would be the artist (Francesco) who would be the cause of delays because it takes longer to draw.

He can't even BEGIN to draw until he gets a script though. Plus he's got to draw other things to in order to earn a living and to pay the rent, and it's hard to schedule his time when he can't know when to expect an AWA script with any regularity. So there is that logic as well.

I agree with Daren, it's not a bad book but it's overrated. Paul Kupperberg had been scripting comics for decades, so despite whatever complicated plot threads had to be woven into LWA, he was a professional who knew how to make a deadline, and didn't have other commitments to television writing, either. For Aguirre-Sacasa, comics comes a distant second to his TV work (that's how HE pays the rent).

Midge gets lumped in with Ethel as gawky and gangly?      The idea that having a short hairstyle somehow makes her unattractive is ridiculous.

Yeah, that must be the reason Reggie has endured hundreds of painful beatings from Moose over the years in his attempt to make time with her. The only other girl that Reggie ever attempts to date anywhere near as frequently is Veronica. There are several stories from the 1960s that imply that Midge is the most desirable girl in Riverdale, including a few where Archie either dates her or attempts to do so. In her earliest appearances, she's always referred to as "the sorority queen", which attests to her social status as one of the most popular girls at Riverdale High -- which makes sense in light of the fact that she's going steady with Moose, who's RHS's star athlete. The context of what makes for interesting stories in Archie Comics means that steady couples like Moose and Midge and Chuck and Nancy are considered boring and thus not given that much attention, even moreso for Midge and Nancy than for Moose and Chuck.

The problem is, Midge is kind of trapped in this one gag, where every setup has some guy who either talks to her or looks at her (or at least Moose so believes), followed by the same (literal) punchline -- a beating by Moose. Midge's potential character development is pretty much imprisoned in that gag situation for as long as it endures, and it's never really gone away.

Professor Bart Beatty of Calgary University, who wrote the only serious critical examination of Archie Comics, TWELVE CENT ARCHIE, claims that Midge is his favorite character.

QuoteI've gone through waves where I've switched in the two and a half years that it took me to put this book together. I went through a long period where I decided that Moose was my favourite character, and then Midge became my favourite character.

Quote from: spazaru on June 23, 2016, 06:15:12 PM

Quote from: BettyReggie on June 23, 2016, 06:09:32 AM
I guess the girls from Josie & The Pussycats are supposed to be older if they are on merchandise already. In this Archie reboot The Archies didn't even start yet.

Josie and the Pussycats have always been older.  In the recent Archie loves Valerie storyline, they mention Archie having to go to high school while Valerie heads out on tour.

Well, Josie, Melody, and Pepper started out as high school students just like Archie and the gang. Somehow when they got a Hanna-Barbera Saturday morning cartoon series they formed a band in the comic book and just sort of stopped going to high school. Although it's just sort of vague as to when, exactly, that might have happened, since in the very first Pussycats story, when Alexander Cabot mentions Valerie's name as a potential member of the prospective group, and Melody asks "Who's Valerie Smith?", Alex replies "She's a new girl in school." -- so apparently, they're still in school when the Pussycats are first formed.

Even so, you get these weird anomalies like the following one-page gag strip from JOSIE #74 (Feb. 1974). How is it that Alexandra and Alan can be in school (and we can see Josie, Melody and Valerie in the same class - could be college, we don't know from the context) in this issue that appeared in late 1973 if they're supposed to be full-time musicians in Josie and the Pussycats? Maybe they're just taking a class at the local community college? Well, I once theorized that this gag was recycled from an older Archie script where the girl would have been Betty and the boy would have been Archie.

Quote from: Midge Klump on June 24, 2016, 10:23:55 AM

I hope so, but what I really hope is the book will be a great and a good representation of those 75 years.

Well, technically only 70 of those 75 years. The hardcover is a Deluxe Edition of THIS book, previously released in 2011, so we know the contents already as far as the story selection goes.

Quote from: Midge Klump on June 24, 2016, 09:07:43 AM

Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 24, 2016, 05:50:56 AM
This is the third (at least) time this book has been solicited. Let's hope it actually sees publication this time around. I'm curious to see what is going to make it "deluxe" -- better paper, coloring, some additional text pieces, or whatever.

What do you think is the hold up for this making it to the shelves?

Hard to say. Lack of large enough pre-order numbers? Or just a lack of cash flow? They recently solved the latter problem with some outside financing, so maybe it'll happen this time, who knows.

This is the third (at least) time this book has been solicited. Let's hope it actually sees publication this time around. I'm curious to see what is going to make it "deluxe" -- better paper, coloring, some additional text pieces, or whatever.

Quote from: Midge Klump on June 23, 2016, 09:49:39 PM

Quote from: invisifan on June 23, 2016, 09:40:52 PM
Welcome — hoping your stay is a long and pleasant one 

Given your interests I'm curious if you are aware of the relationship that's been established in Afterlife with Archie between Ginger (Lopez) and Nancy?

First thanks for the welcome.

I haven't read the Afterlife series, but I am aware of the relationship that is being worked up between Ginger and Nancy and I think it is fantastic. The struggle that these young girls and boys who are going through these issues of coming out of how they feel inside can only be made a little more comfortable even reading it in a comic book. I know when I was 15 years old and I knew who I was but scared as hell to come out to people I loved reading and seeing stories about celebs going through similar issues. Awareness is always important in my book.

Nothing against gay characters in comics (Kevin's book is great), but I hate the way it's handled in AWA. Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa just gives the whole relationship a creepy vibe (but that's true of most of the new angles he's introduced to established characters, and I hate the way he's handling Veronica too).

I mean, yes, it's supposed to be a horror comic, but the way the Ginger/Nancy thing is written, it comes off as distasteful in the same way that he's painted Mr. Lodge as a philanderer and Cheryl and Jason as an incestuous relationship. In the first place, it's not portrayed as a particularly healthy relationship. Their affair is closeted, with Nancy still nominally in a relationship with Chuck, and Nancy's relationship with Ginger is not entirely a balanced one either. Ginger is far more committed, and seems to be pressuring Nancy, who, as far as I can tell, may be what you'd call "bi-curious", and Nancy's lack of committment is causing a seething undercurrent of anger and resentment on Ginger's part. And unfortunately, with everything else going on in the series, it's not something that's been given the space to be dealt with in any depth. It would be a lot easier to accept if RA-S had just made them an openly gay couple -- or if closeted, at least with both of them on the same page as far as how the relationship was working. The fact that Ginger clearly wants this relationship more badly than Nancy does, who may not be entirely comfortable with it or ready for it, and is pressuring her over it and feeling anger and resentment instead of patience and understanding doesn't exactly speak well of her, and there's the lingering feeling that Ginger's anger and resentment over the situation may be foreshadowing... something, I'm not sure exactly what. While that may be an understandable and not unrealistic bit of characterization, it's not as though representation of gays in comics is so common that everyone's going to find it acceptable. To the contrary, it would seem to add fuel to the fire to those who view gays as somewhat predatory... ugh. The jury is definitely still out as far as Nancy's definite sexual orientation (gay, bisexual, or bi-curious), which she may not be entirely sure of yet. Not exactly what I'd hold up as a shining example of LGBT diversity in comics.

Quote from: irishmoxie on June 23, 2016, 01:25:50 PM

Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 23, 2016, 01:12:56 PM
Some of those exclusive variants look great. Especially the Flying Colors Comics (Dez Taylor), Rick's Comic City (Sam Payne), and Stadium Comics (Marco D'Alfonso) covers. I'd love to see any of those guys draw an entire issue.

All you did was pick out the "Classic Archie" variants. 

No, all I did was pick out the ones that looked GOOD to me. 

Here's a couple of covers where the artist of this "New Look" take on Midge and Moose got the original concept right.

Some of those exclusive variants look great. Especially the Flying Colors Comics (Dez Taylor), Rick's Comic City (Sam Payne), and Stadium Comics (Marco D'Alfonso) covers. I'd love to see any of those guys draw an entire issue.

Quote from: Midge Klump on June 23, 2016, 12:44:37 PM
My girlfriend and my Mom are the main ones who compare me to Midge. My girlfriend because she sees my digests all over the house and sometimes glances through them. Yes I will get her to be a fan someday. My Mom because she saw me grow up with Archie comics. To be honest I don't see it other than I have short dark hair. I am extremely short and Midge is not.

The original idea was that Moose is this hulking giant of a guy, and Midge is supposed to be petite. It just makes it look funnier that they're a couple if they're such physical opposites. That sort of got lost over the years, but it's inherent in her name, "Midge" (as in "midget"). If you don't believe it, look at Moose's previous girlfriend from the early 1950s -- the character from whom Midge essentially evolved. Her name was Lottie Little.