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General Category => General Discussion => General Comics => Topic started by: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm

Title: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


I'll probably just wait until all ten pages are up. Just makes more sense... I like to read a complete story or a complete chapter. Most webcomics aren't really written in "newspaper strip" mode. I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about continued stories in monthly comics versus trade collections. It just seems so much more consistent and comprehensible that way (and the problem is compounded the more ongoing comics series you read).

Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 09:13:25 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


I'll probably just wait until all ten pages are up. Just makes more sense... I like to read a complete story or a complete chapter. Most webcomics aren't really written in "newspaper strip" mode. I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about continued stories in monthly comics versus trade collections. It just seems so much more consistent and comprehensible that way (and the problem is compounded the more ongoing comics series you read).

Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?
If you're up to date with the series the "soft reboot" means it's a good point to come in, with most previous plot threads resolved - I was referring to Melissa's condition at the end of it.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 11:38:34 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 09:13:25 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?
If you're up to date with the series the "soft reboot" means it's a good point to come in, with most previous plot threads resolved - I was referring to Melissa's condition at the end of it.


Ah, okay. I didn't look at it yet, but now I noticed the "two Melissas" in in the URL.

I admit to confusion over the term "soft reboot". I KNOW what a reboot is. "Soft reboot" seems to mean different things, depending on who's using it. What Gisele calls a soft reboot, I call a "jump-on point". Sort of like a little clean-up around the house to get rid of the clutter and make things look neat and orderly if you know guests will be arriving, particularly those who aren't regular visitors. Just trying to make things accessible and inviting to the uninitiated. Not really a reboot, since nothing is really changing.


To me "soft reboot" equates more to "bold new direction", a shakeup in status quo.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 09:50:57 am
To me soft reboot just means they change the artists and possibly writers. Content is very similar. I liked the Eerie Cuties story Fernando did. It was like an Archie story but more pg13. I agree it does make a good jumping on point for people who aren't that familiar with it. I'll probably read this one once the story finishes up. Too confusing to read it day by day.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 09:53:20 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


I'll probably just wait until all ten pages are up. Just makes more sense... I like to read a complete story or a complete chapter. Most webcomics aren't really written in "newspaper strip" mode. I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about continued stories in monthly comics versus trade collections. It just seems so much more consistent and comprehensible that way (and the problem is compounded the more ongoing comics series you read).

Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?


But if you only read trade paperbacks there will be low sales of single issues and series will end early and the comic industry could potentially fail.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 10:12:01 am
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 09:53:20 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


I'll probably just wait until all ten pages are up. Just makes more sense... I like to read a complete story or a complete chapter. Most webcomics aren't really written in "newspaper strip" mode. I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about continued stories in monthly comics versus trade collections. It just seems so much more consistent and comprehensible that way (and the problem is compounded the more ongoing comics series you read).

Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?


But if you only read trade paperbacks there will be low sales of single issues and series will end early and the comic industry could potentially fail.



It's probably an inevitable shift. Single issues are shifting to digital (you're living proof of that). Vertigo trade paperback sales have been outselling single issues for years. One issue with multiple stories is practically gone (Archie Comics is evidence of that). Single issues with a single complete story have been on the wane for decades. Consumers obviously overwhelmingly prefer the long-story form, so it shouldn't be surprising the sales of graphic novels and collected editions have grown stronger while floppy comic sales have grown proportionally weaker. Webcomic/digital first to collected edition is the comic industry model of the future.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 12:12:48 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 10:12:01 am
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 09:53:20 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


I'll probably just wait until all ten pages are up. Just makes more sense... I like to read a complete story or a complete chapter. Most webcomics aren't really written in "newspaper strip" mode. I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about continued stories in monthly comics versus trade collections. It just seems so much more consistent and comprehensible that way (and the problem is compounded the more ongoing comics series you read).

Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?


But if you only read trade paperbacks there will be low sales of single issues and series will end early and the comic industry could potentially fail.



It's probably an inevitable shift. Single issues are shifting to digital (you're living proof of that). Vertigo trade paperback sales have been outselling single issues for years. One issue with multiple stories is practically gone (Archie Comics is evidence of that). Single issues with a single complete story have been on the wane for decades. Consumers obviously overwhelmingly prefer the long-story form, so it shouldn't be surprising the sales of graphic novels and collected editions have grown stronger while floppy comic sales have grown proportionally weaker. Webcomic/digital first to collected edition is the comic industry model of the future.


Yep. And the only reason to buy single issues anymore is for the variant cover. ;)

Makes me wonder why they don't just ditch the single issues all together and just put out trades like manga has done. They would release product less often but I guess they are making more money because trades sell more copies (even though if you bought every single issue it would cost you more than the trade.)
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 12:26:00 pm
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 12:12:48 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 10:12:01 am
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 09:53:20 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


I'll probably just wait until all ten pages are up. Just makes more sense... I like to read a complete story or a complete chapter. Most webcomics aren't really written in "newspaper strip" mode. I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about continued stories in monthly comics versus trade collections. It just seems so much more consistent and comprehensible that way (and the problem is compounded the more ongoing comics series you read).

Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?


But if you only read trade paperbacks there will be low sales of single issues and series will end early and the comic industry could potentially fail.



It's probably an inevitable shift. Single issues are shifting to digital (you're living proof of that). Vertigo trade paperback sales have been outselling single issues for years. One issue with multiple stories is practically gone (Archie Comics is evidence of that). Single issues with a single complete story have been on the wane for decades. Consumers obviously overwhelmingly prefer the long-story form, so it shouldn't be surprising the sales of graphic novels and collected editions have grown stronger while floppy comic sales have grown proportionally weaker. Webcomic/digital first to collected edition is the comic industry model of the future.


Yep. And the only reason to buy single issues anymore is for the variant cover. ;)

Makes me wonder why they don't just ditch the single issues all together and just put out trades like manga has done. They would release product less often but I guess they are making more money because trades sell more copies (even though if you bought every single issue it would cost you more than the trade.)



And the only reason variant covers exist is to service collectors, not readers. And of course, comic book shops... because that's where collectors go. Not all collectors care about variant covers, but the publishers are trying to generate money by catering to the desire to own physical art objects, as opposed to just enjoying the art itself. Of course you could just enjoy looking at JPG images of the cover art, or the publishers could just put out an art book or something. But I guess you can't blame them if people want to pay another $4, $10, or even more, for another copy of the same comic book story with a different cover over it. In a lot of ways the old model is battling against the new model, because comic shops were built on floppy comic sales to comic book collectors, and most people accustomed to that way of relating to their hobby don't want it to change.


The manga industry doesn't just put out trades. In the U.S., publishers print translated reprints of collected editions of manga stories that originally appeared in thick comic anthologies that are printed cheaply and appear weekly, bi-weekly, or monthly and give the Japanese readers a chance to follow and preview a lot of different series at once, before the inevitable collection appears.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: invisifan on May 18, 2016, 01:38:38 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 12:26:00 pm
... Of course you could just enjoy looking at JPG images of the cover art, or ...

Seriously? JPG is so last decade (if not millennium) ... Not that being "stuck in the past isn't the condition of far too many people, but really, jpeg isn't a format that ought to be used for anything these days (especially not any sort of art) ...
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 01:53:42 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 12:26:00 pm
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 12:12:48 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 10:12:01 am
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 09:53:20 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 17, 2016, 08:08:48 pm
Quote from: invisifan on May 17, 2016, 06:20:30 pm
Starting a 10-pager: http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10 (http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10)

::) If you haven;t read the story to this point you have to take the split at face value ...


I'll probably just wait until all ten pages are up. Just makes more sense... I like to read a complete story or a complete chapter. Most webcomics aren't really written in "newspaper strip" mode. I'm even kind of starting to feel that way about continued stories in monthly comics versus trade collections. It just seems so much more consistent and comprehensible that way (and the problem is compounded the more ongoing comics series you read).

Isn't Gisele calling the new EC/MC (since returning from hiatus) a "soft reboot" now? What split?


But if you only read trade paperbacks there will be low sales of single issues and series will end early and the comic industry could potentially fail.



It's probably an inevitable shift. Single issues are shifting to digital (you're living proof of that). Vertigo trade paperback sales have been outselling single issues for years. One issue with multiple stories is practically gone (Archie Comics is evidence of that). Single issues with a single complete story have been on the wane for decades. Consumers obviously overwhelmingly prefer the long-story form, so it shouldn't be surprising the sales of graphic novels and collected editions have grown stronger while floppy comic sales have grown proportionally weaker. Webcomic/digital first to collected edition is the comic industry model of the future.


Yep. And the only reason to buy single issues anymore is for the variant cover. ;)

Makes me wonder why they don't just ditch the single issues all together and just put out trades like manga has done. They would release product less often but I guess they are making more money because trades sell more copies (even though if you bought every single issue it would cost you more than the trade.)



And the only reason variant covers exist is to service collectors, not readers. And of course, comic book shops... because that's where collectors go. Not all collectors care about variant covers, but the publishers are trying to generate money by catering to the desire to own physical art objects, as opposed to just enjoying the art itself. Of course you could just enjoy looking at JPG images of the cover art, or the publishers could just put out an art book or something. But I guess you can't blame them if people want to pay another $4, $10, or even more, for another copy of the same comic book story with a different cover over it. In a lot of ways the old model is battling against the new model, because comic shops were built on floppy comic sales to comic book collectors, and most people accustomed to that way of relating to their hobby don't want it to change.


The manga industry doesn't just put out trades. In the U.S., publishers print translated reprints of collected editions of manga stories that originally appeared in thick comic anthologies that are printed cheaply and appear weekly, bi-weekly, or monthly and give the Japanese readers a chance to follow and preview a lot of different series at once, before the inevitable collection appears.


Yes I'm aware manga is originally published in magazines. They've tried a few of those magazines here but they usually fail. So all that's really left are the paperbacks or digital if you're an English reader.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 03:24:18 pm
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 01:53:42 pm
Yes I'm aware manga is originally published in magazines. They've tried a few of those magazines here but they usually fail. So all that's really left are the paperbacks or digital if you're an English reader.



Manga in the U.S. is an anomaly in comic publishing, because its adoption into Western culture is being driven by a bleeding-edge fandom of early adopters. They're the ones who buy the imported comics in the original Japanese, and have taken the trouble to learn Japanese themselves in order to read them. They're the scanslators and the people behind the publishing scene from whom the English-language manga publishers are taking their cues. What gets translated in the U.S. is a combination of that which has already proved popular in Japan (to the degree that it's universal, as opposed to culturally-specific), and what the hardcore manga fans who read Japanese are recommending to each other by word of mouth and the internet. A lot of them have even worked themselves into some key positions on the U.S. publishing side.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 06:45:51 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on May 18, 2016, 03:24:18 pm
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 01:53:42 pm
Yes I'm aware manga is originally published in magazines. They've tried a few of those magazines here but they usually fail. So all that's really left are the paperbacks or digital if you're an English reader.



Manga in the U.S. is an anomaly in comic publishing, because its adoption into Western culture is being driven by a bleeding-edge fandom of early adopters. They're the ones who buy the imported comics in the original Japanese, and have taken the trouble to learn Japanese themselves in order to read them. They're the scanslators and the people behind the publishing scene from whom the English-language manga publishers are taking their cues. What gets translated in the U.S. is a combination of that which has already proved popular in Japan (to the degree that it's universal, as opposed to culturally-specific), and what the hardcore manga fans who read Japanese are recommending to each other by word of mouth and the internet. A lot of them have even worked themselves into some key positions on the U.S. publishing side.


A lot of what they're trying to publish now (or maybe just what I buy and am interested in) is stuff that doesn't get scanalated presumably to make the most profit. They also tried to capitalize on the popularity of Twilight and publish a lot of vampire manga which is unfortunate.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: invisifan on May 18, 2016, 09:55:14 pm
Vampires are far too over-exposed -- but rarely to the sun  :P
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on May 19, 2016, 12:29:09 am
Quote from: irishmoxie on May 18, 2016, 06:45:51 pm
A lot of what they're trying to publish now (or maybe just what I buy and am interested in) is stuff that doesn't get scanalated presumably to make the most profit.


The scanslations aren't being quelched by legal action on the part of the publishers (on either the Japanese or the U.S. side) because they don't really impact print sales of manga at all. To the contrary, they sort of test the waters for the popularity of any given manga with an English-reading audience. It's not like the publishers have any input into what gets scanslated; that's totally up to the devoted fans spending their own time and effort to do them. It's no different than the bootlegging of subtitled Japanese anime that hasn't been made available officially. UNlike that activity however, scanslations are a not-for-profit fan activity, and most scanslations get taken down and removed once the manga has received an official commerical English-language release, because the scanslators want to play fair, and encourage the U.S. publishers doing official English-language translations. On the other hand, sometimes existing deals between U.S. publishers (or the U.S. branch of a Japanese publisher) have their own ideas and vested interests in trying to translate things to English that aren't being driven strictly by keeping a finger on the pulse of English-speaking manga fans.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: invisifan on June 21, 2016, 03:20:53 pm
The 10th (last) page of the story (http://"http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10") is up now. New Arc starts in July.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on June 21, 2016, 07:39:07 pm
Quote from: invisifan on June 21, 2016, 03:20:53 pm
The 10th (last) page of the story (http://"http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10") is up now. New Arc starts in July.


I'm going to read it now.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 23, 2016, 04:46:12 am
Quote from: invisifan on June 21, 2016, 03:20:53 pm
The 10th (last) page of the story (http://"http://www.magickchicks.com/strips-mc/mc_soft_reboot_-_two_melissas_-_pg_1_of_10") is up now. New Arc starts in July.


Read it, loved it! As an aside, that makes TWO homages to I Dream of Jeannie for Dan Parent in a single month (the other was in the new story in this month's BETTY AND VERONICA SUMMER ANNUAL #244). Not sure if Dave Lumsden wrote that scene in there specifically for Dan, or that's just the way it turned out. Technically, in this story there's no genie... but a magical girl in an Arabian harem outfit is close enough.

I question why they're calling this a "soft reboot", though. If it's NOT a reboot (and it isn't) then the word "reboot" shouldn't even be in there anywhere. That just causes a small twinge of panic for readers who've been following the series regularly up to that point -- like the Red Alert signs start flashing and the "AAAOOOOOHGAH! AAAOOOOOHGAH!" klaxons start going off.

I don't even know that there's any consensus on what the term "soft reboot" means, or what people might think it means. It seems to imply some kind of "minor" reboot, like a slight adjustment where there's a continuity implant and/or some sort of vague "selective amnesia" by which they're agreeing to forget about certain overly-complex recent events, like "We shall never speak of this again." The only real thing that comes to mind that might fit that description is something like Spider-Man's "Brand New Day", after Mephisto selectively tinkered with Peter Parker's past history (or memories -- I'm still a little vague on that).

I've seen it used in a couple of instances to indicate what's known as a "jump-on point" -- i.e., a point in an otherwise complex storyline that's kind of a "lull" between major arcs where it's designed to be accessible to new readers... the perfect place to start reading, if you haven't been following up to this point. And obviously, by using classic Archie artists like Fernando Ruiz and Dan Parent, you might hope to lure fans of classic Archie stories. As it turns out, Fernando's story functioned pretty well at that, but I don't know about this one. While I loved it, and understood everything happening with no problem, I wonder if someone reading Magick Chicks for the first time would. It just seems like this little story casts the focus on what might be construed as the most complicated parts of Melissa's backstory, but doesn't go a long way to explaining how things got that way for new readers.

At any rate, this story just seems like a "bonus story", like something you'd find in the back of an Annual that came out in-between story arcs in a series that had fairly complex continuity. Sort of just like a little "afterstory" or coda to the climactic events that just wrapped up, before launching into a whole new series of adventures.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on June 23, 2016, 05:16:43 am
I didn't really understand the story at all and I haven't read much of Magick Chicks. I liked Fernando's story better. The art is great in all of Pixie Trix's comics but I think I just don't get or like Dave Lumsden's writing style. Menage a Trois I thought was the funniest. When does the girl band part start?
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 23, 2016, 07:17:42 am
Quote from: irishmoxie on June 23, 2016, 05:16:43 am
I didn't really understand the story at all and I haven't read much of Magick Chicks. I liked Fernando's story better. The art is great in all of Pixie Trix's comics but I think I just don't get or like Dave Lumsden's writing style.


I guess that pretty well proves the point I was trying to make. If by "soft reboot" they meant "jump-on point", then this story isn't very accessible to new readers. You need to know too much backstory going into it to understand what's going on.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Midge Klump on June 25, 2016, 01:49:21 pm
I have been a Menage A 3 reader but have not read Magick Chiks. I love the artwork of Gisele and the creative works of Gisele, Dan Parent, and Fernando Ruiz so this and Eerie Cuties will most likely be right up my alley. I will most certainly be taking a look see.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 12:35:27 am
Quote from: Midge Klump on June 25, 2016, 01:49:21 pm
I have been a Menage A 3 reader but have not read Magick Chiks. I love the artwork of Gisele and the creative works of Gisele, Dan Parent, and Fernando Ruiz so this and Eerie Cuties will most likely be right up my alley. I will most certainly be taking a look see.


I've read all of Eerie Cuties, Magick Chicks and Dangerously Chloe, but have barely read any of MA3.

I think it's the single strip format that I find daunting, as a webcomic. Too much clicking for too little reading per click, and there are a LOT of back pages to get through, which is why I never got that far into it. I wish it were like a regular comic format page. I wonder what the print format looks like, if they rearrange the panels to fit on a comic format page or how they do it.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Midge Klump on June 26, 2016, 12:54:30 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 12:35:27 am
Quote from: Midge Klump on June 25, 2016, 01:49:21 pm
I have been a Menage A 3 reader but have not read Magick Chiks. I love the artwork of Gisele and the creative works of Gisele, Dan Parent, and Fernando Ruiz so this and Eerie Cuties will most likely be right up my alley. I will most certainly be taking a look see.


I've read all of Eerie Cuties, Magick Chicks and Dangerously Chloe, but have barely read any of MA3.

I think it's the single strip format that I find daunting, as a webcomic. Too much clicking for too little reading per click, and there are a LOT of back pages to get through, which is why I never got that far into it. I wish it were like a regular comic format page. I wonder what the print format looks like, if they rearrange the panels to fit on a comic format page or how they do it.
I would imagine they would rearrange the panels so it would fit on a full single page.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 01:43:02 am
Quote from: Midge Klump on June 26, 2016, 12:54:30 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 12:35:27 am
Quote from: Midge Klump on June 25, 2016, 01:49:21 pm
I have been a Menage A 3 reader but have not read Magick Chiks. I love the artwork of Gisele and the creative works of Gisele, Dan Parent, and Fernando Ruiz so this and Eerie Cuties will most likely be right up my alley. I will most certainly be taking a look see.


I've read all of Eerie Cuties, Magick Chicks and Dangerously Chloe, but have barely read any of MA3.

I think it's the single strip format that I find daunting, as a webcomic. Too much clicking for too little reading per click, and there are a LOT of back pages to get through, which is why I never got that far into it. I wish it were like a regular comic format page. I wonder what the print format looks like, if they rearrange the panels to fit on a comic format page or how they do it.
I would imagine they would rearrange the panels so it would fit on a full single page.


Okay, I just did a search for a digital copy of the print edition and found it on ComiXology, along with a few preview pages. They do rearrange the panels into a 4-panel 2x2 grid for each page (so I assume that the 4 same-sized panel format is an unbreakable rule for each strip).

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/S/cmx-images-prod/DigitalPage/31511074/7aedba707d0ddb2c8d81432a6da14689._SX640_QL80_TTD_.jpg)
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on June 26, 2016, 03:34:18 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 01:43:02 am
They do rearrange the panels into a 4-panel 2x2 grid for each page (so I assume that the 4 same-sized panel format is an unbreakable rule for each strip).


The only rule we have is that the comic needs to split in half. We can do as many panels as we want in each half. PDFs are also available here https://gumroad.com/pixietrixcomix/ but you won't get the panel to panel guided view like comixology. I'm behind in sending stuff to comixology for them to add but all books will eventually be there.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 06:15:09 am
Quote from: Gisele on June 26, 2016, 03:34:18 am
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 01:43:02 am
They do rearrange the panels into a 4-panel 2x2 grid for each page (so I assume that the 4 same-sized panel format is an unbreakable rule for each strip).


The only rule we have is that the comic needs to split in half. We can do as many panels as we want in each half. PDFs are also available here https://gumroad.com/pixietrixcomix/ (https://gumroad.com/pixietrixcomix/) but you won't get the panel to panel guided view like comixology. I'm behind in sending stuff to comixology for them to add but all books will eventually be there.


Here's a question. Was the format for the strip decided upon with an eye towards its potential as a feature for inclusion in various alternative newspapers? And has that actually happened?
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on June 26, 2016, 06:53:52 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 06:15:09 am
Here's a question. Was the format for the strip decided upon with an eye towards its potential as a feature for inclusion in various alternative newspapers? And has that actually happened?


I've always loved the newspaper strip format. If you look at all my projects, that's how they all started: Cool Cat Studio, Penny & Aggie, Menage a 3, even Eerie Cuties. Penny & Aggie was the only one that I REALLY tried to get in the newspapers, and we almost did with the Washington Post. Once that didn't happen, T Campbell and I decided to switch the comic to a full page format to do more complex storylines. Plus, it's what the readers wanted. After a while of that, I felt the need to draw gags again, and Menage a 3 was born. I knew going in that it would never be in newspapers, and I didn't care. I wanted to do something fun, and something where I didn't have to take myself seriously. Doing more absurd humor was something I had never really done, and here was my chance. I honestly didn't think it would catch on either but it did, and boy did it ever. It surpassed anything I had ever done in terms of readership and support from readers. I guess many were looking for something like Ma3 when it came out back in 2008. So to answer your question, no, we never thought Ma3 would be in newspapers, and we never tried to either. I did make a conscious decision at the very beginning that the strip would split in half so it would be easier to collect in a more standard format. I honestly fell in love with the format as it's very flexible.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 01:53:21 am
Quote from: Gisele on June 26, 2016, 06:53:52 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 26, 2016, 06:15:09 am
Here's a question. Was the format for the strip decided upon with an eye towards its potential as a feature for inclusion in various alternative newspapers? And has that actually happened?


I've always loved the newspaper strip format. If you look at all my projects, that's how they all started: Cool Cat Studio, Penny & Aggie, Menage a 3, even Eerie Cuties. Penny & Aggie was the only one that I REALLY tried to get in the newspapers, and we almost did with the Washington Post. Once that didn't happen, T Campbell and I decided to switch the comic to a full page format to do more complex storylines. Plus, it's what the readers wanted. After a while of that, I felt the need to draw gags again, and Menage a 3 was born. I knew going in that it would never be in newspapers, and I didn't care. I wanted to do something fun, and something where I didn't have to take myself seriously. Doing more absurd humor was something I had never really done, and here was my chance. I honestly didn't think it would catch on either but it did, and boy did it ever. It surpassed anything I had ever done in terms of readership and support from readers. I guess many were looking for something like Ma3 when it came out back in 2008. So to answer your question, no, we never thought Ma3 would be in newspapers, and we never tried to either. I did make a conscious decision at the very beginning that the strip would split in half so it would be easier to collect in a more standard format. I honestly fell in love with the format as it's very flexible.


Maybe it's time for you to reconsider shopping it around to various alternative press newspapers or magazines. According to Wikipedia:
QuoteMénage à 3 is consistently rated in the top 50 webcomics on the internet and is one of the top 25 most read.


Surely those kind of statistics might cause an alternative press editor to give it some serious consideration for inclusion in their comix section? Congratulations are in order in any case -- it seems you really tapped into the current cultural zeitgeist with MA3.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on June 27, 2016, 03:03:32 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 01:53:21 am
Maybe it's time for you to reconsider shopping it around to various alternative press newspapers or magazines. According to Wikipedia:
Ménage à 3 is consistently rated in the top 50 webcomics on the internet and is one of the top 25 most read.

Surely those kind of statistics might cause an alternative press editor to give it some serious consideration for inclusion in their comix section? Congratulations are in order in any case -- it seems you really tapped into the current cultural zeitgeist with MA3.


We've had interest from a few publishers to publish Ma3 but we do pretty well self-publishing it, and we get to keep all profits. Maybe we'll go the traditional route for omnibus editions. :)
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 04:00:31 pm
Quote from: Gisele on June 27, 2016, 03:03:32 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 01:53:21 am
Maybe it's time for you to reconsider shopping it around to various alternative press newspapers or magazines. According to Wikipedia:
Ménage à 3 is consistently rated in the top 50 webcomics on the internet and is one of the top 25 most read.

Surely those kind of statistics might cause an alternative press editor to give it some serious consideration for inclusion in their comix section? Congratulations are in order in any case -- it seems you really tapped into the current cultural zeitgeist with MA3.


We've had interest from a few publishers to publish Ma3 but we do pretty well self-publishing it, and we get to keep all profits. Maybe we'll go the traditional route for omnibus editions. :)


Wouldn't it just be an additional revenue stream? Something like self-syndication? I'd assume the the readership of these alternative papers or magazines has pretty much zero overlap with the people currently reading the webcomic or buying digital or print compilations. Not to say that some of those alternative paper or magazine readers couldn't then JOIN the existing group of webcomic/compilation readers. I just thought it would be another way of getting exposure to an audience that would like it, but wouldn't have necessarily gone looking for it in the first place, because they may never have heard of it yet.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on June 27, 2016, 04:12:38 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 04:00:31 pm
Wouldn't it just be an additional revenue stream? Something like self-syndication? I'd assume the the readership of these alternative papers or magazines has pretty much zero overlap with the people currently reading the webcomic or buying digital or print compilations. Not to say that some of those alternative paper or magazine readers couldn't then JOIN the existing group of webcomic/compilation readers. I just thought it would be another way of getting exposure to an audience that would like it, but wouldn't have necessarily gone looking for it in the first place, because they may never have heard of it yet.


Sorry, I was talking about comics publishers. We were never approached to be in papers. It would really have to be something super alternative to accept the more risqué content. I don't think we'd say no if we were approached. As for books in the direct market, we'll eventually get in there. More than likely with omnibus editions using a publisher who understands the direct market more than we do.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 04:29:52 pm
Quote from: Gisele on June 27, 2016, 04:12:38 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 04:00:31 pm
Wouldn't it just be an additional revenue stream? Something like self-syndication? I'd assume the the readership of these alternative papers or magazines has pretty much zero overlap with the people currently reading the webcomic or buying digital or print compilations. Not to say that some of those alternative paper or magazine readers couldn't then JOIN the existing group of webcomic/compilation readers. I just thought it would be another way of getting exposure to an audience that would like it, but wouldn't have necessarily gone looking for it in the first place, because they may never have heard of it yet.


Sorry, I was talking about comics publishers. We were never approached to be in papers. It would really have to be something super alternative to accept the more risqué content. I don't think we'd say no if we were approached. As for books in the direct market, we'll eventually get in there. More than likely with omnibus editions using a publisher who understands the direct market more than we do.


Oh, no... I wasn't talking about comic shops, I was talking about... I don't know what you'd call it. The underground press? Alternative lifestyle magazines? Like you see in major urban areas, supported by a lot of advertising, priced cheaply, or sometimes given away for free (for the newspapers, anyway... the alternative lifestyle magazines usually have smaller circulations, but cater to a very specific demographic). I mean, all you need to do is look under Classified, and Singles, and you can see that these papers are liberal, tolerant, and broad-minded.

I can't believe you don't have these in the major Canadian cities (especially Montreal and Toronto, places like that). You know, film reviews, political articles, arts stuff, music, college and youth culture. Like the kind of papers that carried Matt Groening's LIFE IN HELL comic strip. Boston has The Boston Phoenix, but that's a lot tamer than it started out. I don't know that it carries comix or not. Not all of them do.

If you're waiting for a phone call, it probably won't happen because they don't know MA3 exists. I guess it would be up to you to scout out potential clients and send them samples, based on looking at the content of the newspaper or magazine, and whether it was a venue where your strip would fit. Even if they don't have a comix section per se, doesn't mean they might not be interested. I'd start by looking at what's being published in Montreal, and work outward from there. I mean, you could send out a dozen samples, or two dozen. Might never hear anything, or just a polite "can't use it at this time" letter. On the other hand, the phone MIGHT ring then, because at least you let them know you exist.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on June 27, 2016, 06:03:14 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 27, 2016, 04:29:52 pm
Oh, no... I wasn't talking about comic shops, I was talking about... I don't know what you'd call it. The underground press? Alternative lifestyle magazines? Like you see in major urban areas, supported by a lot of advertising, priced cheaply, or sometimes given away for free (for the newspapers, anyway... the alternative lifestyle magazines usually have smaller circulations, but cater to a very specific demographic). I mean, all you need to do is look under Classified, and Singles, and you can see that these papers are liberal, tolerant, and broad-minded.

I can't believe you don't have these in the major Canadian cities (especially Montreal and Toronto, places like that). You know, film reviews, political articles, arts stuff, music, college and youth culture. Like the kind of papers that carried Matt Groening's LIFE IN HELL comic strip. Boston has The Boston Phoenix, but that's a lot tamer than it started out. I don't know that it carries comix or not. Not all of them do.

If you're waiting for a phone call, it probably won't happen because they don't know MA3 exists. I guess it would be up to you to scout out potential clients and send them samples, based on looking at the content of the newspaper or magazine, and whether it was a venue where your strip would fit. Even if they don't have a comix section per se, doesn't mean they might not be interested. I'd start by looking at what's being published in Montreal, and work outward from there. I mean, you could send out a dozen samples, or two dozen. Might never hear anything, or just a polite "can't use it at this time" letter. On the other hand, the phone MIGHT ring then, because at least you let them know you exist.


At its peak, Ma3 had roughly half a million unique readers a month with over 6 million pageviews a month. Like any comic that has lasted this long, there's a drop over time. The comic still does well, and the true fans support it by buying books and removing ad blocker when they visit the site. I'm pretty sure enough people know about it that some of these folks in papers would be aware of it. I remember this one indie paper in Montreal, when I lived there... no idea if it's still around. Even then, with Penny & Aggie, we did go into these and we never saw a penny from that. I mean, it might increase readership a little but money wise, I wouldn't expect much. Right now, I'm focusing on doing more conventions than I used to (which was nil) to try and grab more people there, and I've started to accept doing more mainstream gigs to attract people to my indie work. Again, this is to supplement what's already there like you say. I could try and put the effort of finding all these indie papers and sending out emails & all but that's more work for me, and really, I'm maxed in terms of what I can physically do in a day already.

Edit: I should clarify that in webcomics, only about 1% of the readership ends up buying books and supporting via buying stuff, etc. Soooo, even though readership is high, you only grab 1% to actually buy stuff. The rest of the money is made via eyeballs and ad revenue (with those who don't have ad blockers.)
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on June 27, 2016, 08:44:54 pm
Newspapers are dying if not dead. Usually those free magazines don't have anything worth reading in them. There's a reason they're free. Gisele is smart to do conventions. That's how most comic artists survive these days from commissions. Look at Dan Parent. He's the convention King.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 28, 2016, 02:47:09 pm
Okay. Whatever. It was just an idea. Not that it's going to make anyone rich or anything. The alternative paper readership probably is not doing as badly, relatively speaking, as the mainstream newspapers are, because they're filling a gap that the mainstream papers are failing to address. The reason they're free is to increase the circulation, because it's ADVERTISERS who foot the bills for the publishing of those papers, not readers.

Yes, some of the readers of those papers are undoubtedly aware of MA3, but compared to the number of people in the publisher or editor positions at the paper, it might only be a half-dozen people, and they're not necessarily the type of people who are already immersed in comics culture and webcomics.

And I know it was ages ago, relatively speaking, but you know... what I was thinking of there was Groening's LIFE IN HELL, which kind of put him on the map, and somehow from there he got to do The Simpsons. Granted, it's a different world now, but just because you have millions of readers who somehow discover the webcomics, there's a schism there with the world of mainstream (or in this case, alternative to mainstream) culture. You never really know who reads those papers, and what connections that might lead to. Or not.

But on a completely different topic, I can't see MA3 doing much in the direct market, either. Eerie Cuties and Magick Chicks might do better, and could presumably be racked along with the manga. MA3, I think, would be difficult... It doesn't really fit in with mainstream comics (not even the indies), and it doesn't really fit with the Fantagraphics/Drawn & Quarterly-type alternative stuff. It's too "Mature Audiences" for the manga section, and it doesn't really fit in Diamond's Adult catalog either, because (ironically) it's too tame, compared to the usual erotica and hentai stuff they list.  I mean, nothing ventured, nothing gained, I guess. You could always submit it to Diamond to see whether they'd be interested. The overhead costs to you for printing might make it more trouble than it's worth, though.

On the other hand, it seems to me you're missing a good bet by not having MA3 (AND the rest of the Pixie Trix titles) on Amazon's CreateSpace Print-On-Demand service. As long as you have an Amazon seller's account, you can sell both digital copies and print. You supply them with the PDFs, they supply the printing/binding machine, and exposure to millions of potential customers. One customer order = one copy printed on demand. That's pretty low overhead cost to the publisher for the ability to connect with potential consumers.

Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: irishmoxie on June 28, 2016, 03:07:02 pm
There's probably some cost to host your product. Same with Comixology. I assume there is some cost because I noticed some digital things expire after while and are no longer listed on the site. The cost may not outweigh the potential benefit.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 28, 2016, 03:34:03 pm
Quote from: irishmoxie on June 28, 2016, 03:07:02 pm
There's probably some cost to host your product. Same with Comixology. I assume there is some cost because I noticed some digital things expire after while and are no longer listed on the site. The cost may not outweigh the potential benefit.


Of COURSE Amazon isn't doing this out of altruism. They have to make a profit. But the publisher's overhead is low compared to having to contract with a printer for a print run, which would be the case going through direct distribution with Diamond Comics. And of course, you have options as a seller. You can sell digital only, digital + POD (printed and shipped by Amazon), or digital plus print sales (Z-shops) from your existing print stock (shipped by the publisher, not Amazon).
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on June 28, 2016, 08:59:43 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 28, 2016, 03:34:03 pm
Of COURSE Amazon isn't doing this out of altruism. They have to make a profit. But the publisher's overhead is low compared to having to contract with a printer for a print run, which would be the case going through direct distribution with Diamond Comics. And of course, you have options as a seller. You can sell digital only, digital + POD (printed and shipped by Amazon), or digital plus print sales (Z-shops) from your existing print stock (shipped by the publisher, not Amazon).


There's no cost to put books on Amazon. You just lose roughly 70% of the sale! Use a publisher, and you're left with 10% of the sale!
I prefer to sell directly using big cartel/gumroad and keep most of the profits (so I can eat!)
I don't use print-on-demand 'cause I have enough books to sell right here in my basement.
We sell quite well in our store, and the Kickstarters do well.
Here's an example of a typical day when we're busy with our Kickstarter...
https://www.facebook.com/pixietrixcomix/photos/pb.1523482044584339.-2207520000.1467160989./1531220797143797/?type=3&theater

Then, well, with the Kickstarters, we offer a lot and get a lot made (dolls, books, plushies, you name it!):
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/pixietrixcomix/menage-a-3-volume-6
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/pixietrixcomix/menage-a-3-volume-7-and-more
Our store:
http://pixietrixcomixstore.bigcartel.com/

I think we'd do OK in the direct market, and I've had many chances to put our books in there, but it's been a conscious decision not to do so up to now. Like I said, I think we'll go in the direct market via omnibus editions but I may change my mind. I follow my gut as to what I think makes the most sense financially.

I've also watched others try to expand into other things like animation, and seen the trouble it brought. I'm not saying I won't, but it needs to feel right. In a sense, we're a little like Terry Moore with Strangers in Paradise. It did well for him, and he makes money from it still, but he never went much further with it. Doesn't mean he didn't want to (or won't in the future,) but if all offers that show up don't feel right, well, you know... you pass on them. Jeff Smith is pretty much the same way with Bone. These guys are direct market guys, but if they were younger, they might be doing exactly what I'm doing now. It's hard to say.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on June 28, 2016, 09:19:25 pm
Quote from: Gisele on June 28, 2016, 08:59:43 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on June 28, 2016, 03:34:03 pm
Of COURSE Amazon isn't doing this out of altruism. They have to make a profit. But the publisher's overhead is low compared to having to contract with a printer for a print run, which would be the case going through direct distribution with Diamond Comics. And of course, you have options as a seller. You can sell digital only, digital + POD (printed and shipped by Amazon), or digital plus print sales (Z-shops) from your existing print stock (shipped by the publisher, not Amazon).


There's no cost to put books on Amazon. You just lose roughly 70% of the sale! Use a publisher, and you're left with 10% of the sale!


That's pretty much what I said, isn't it? Amazon makes its profit off every sale, but 30% of the sale price is better than the 10% you'd get from Diamond (and you have to cover your own printing costs).

The math doesn't lie. 30% of nothing is still nothing, and is the same amount as 10% of nothing. So if you don't sell a copy on Amazon, that's what you're getting, nothing. It's not an either/or situation, it's profit in addition to the profit you're already making! MOST of those potential Amazon customers have never even heard of Gumroad, so you're really not competing with yourself. So what if you make more profit off a print copy you sold on Gumroad or a digital one that you sold on ComiXology? Money is money. What's your out-of-pocket expense for putting the digital copy on Amazon? It's a numbers racket, and it all comes down to selling more copies.

What you do is you put it up on Amazon, and YOUR existing readers SELL the book for you to people who have never even heard of your comics. That's why there are all those links in there to other products that the same customers bought. So if someone bought RANMA 1/2, and they also bought EERIE CUTIES, then your product appears on the page for people who are looking for RANMA 1/2. Then if they click on it, and read positive reviews for EERIE CUTIES that (for example) compare it favorably to RANMA 1/2, people are likely to order products that other people that like the same things as them (like RANMA 1/2 for example) liked. I can't even begin to tell you all the money I've spent on products from Amazon that I would never have known existed if they hadn't been linked to other products that I happened to be actually looking for.

Another point to add is that people buy a lot of stuff from Amazon because it's the big-box warehouse superstore of the internet. Just like someone goes to Walmart or Target if they can find 10 different things they're looking for, instead of say, going to the mall and walking around to 4 or 5 different stores. One-stop shopping. Funny thing about that though -- if I only went to Target looking for 10 different things, somehow, I wind up walking out with 6 or 8 extra things I didn't plan on buying in the first place.

If I like comics from Marvel, IDW, and Archie, and Pixie Trix, then the same thinking applies. I don't want to go to a store for each individual product I'm looking to buy if I can get it all in one place (and many people get the Amazon Prime account, because that is their #1 MAIN store to shop at, but otherwise if you spend $40 you can get free shipping). But the same applies whether we're talking about free shipping or just the convenience of not hopping back and forth between a number of different online stores where you have to create a new account, etc. No lie -- I live in a condo building with an outside mailbox, and I look out the window to check to see if the mail's been delivered by looking at my neighbor across the parking lot's front doorstep -- this family has 2 to 4 packages from Amazon delivered almost every single day.

Well, now I have to be brutally honest and admit my own experience. I once went to Gumroad and filled up a shopping cart with $150 dollars worth of your print editions. When I saw the shipping charges, I hesitated. Then I divided the total cost with shipping by the number of books I was ordering, to see what each individual book was actually costing me. Long story short -- I didn't complete the order. Now, I would love to find those same books at my local comic store or a convention, and would happily pay what I consider to be an extremely reasonable cover price for them. If the print versions were available to order on Amazon, I would have ordered them long ago. In the 20 years I've been shopping on Amazon, I've NEVER paid a shipping charge, except if it was a z-shops seller shipping an out-of-print book that I just HAD to have. All of the products that I've ordered over the years (and it's probably better that I DON'T know how much I've spent there over the years) have been shipped to me from Amazon for free, because I NEVER have a problem finding $40 (used to be $25, years ago) worth of products that I need there.

You just have to look at the glass half-full perspective, not the other way around.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on June 28, 2016, 10:10:36 pm
My issue was more about losing existing sales to Amazon. Current buyers might prefer to go to Amazon 'cause they can get free shipping and bundle it up with something else. If I get too many of those, I almost have to sell double what I do now to make up for it. If I don't sell double, I'm losing. Sure, I might get more sales, but that doesn't mean more money. In any case, like I said, I'm considering it. I'm just very slow at doing this 'cause, well, I do everything myself for the most part, and have a lot of the go. It's no surprise people like to use publishers to put out their work as they don't have to worry about this stuff, but when you get 10% of profits as a creator when using a publisher, you have to sell a whole lot of books, and I know that there are many creators out there who sell more books than I do but are poorer 'cause of the way the system works. But again, I may jump in once I feel it's safe hehe ;)
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: DeCarlo Rules on July 04, 2016, 01:20:31 am
Quote from: Gisele on June 28, 2016, 10:10:36 pm
My issue was more about losing existing sales to Amazon. Current buyers might prefer to go to Amazon 'cause they can get free shipping and bundle it up with something else. If I get too many of those, I almost have to sell double what I do now to make up for it. If I don't sell double, I'm losing. Sure, I might get more sales, but that doesn't mean more money. In any case, like I said, I'm considering it. I'm just very slow at doing this 'cause, well, I do everything myself for the most part, and have a lot of the go. It's no surprise people like to use publishers to put out their work as they don't have to worry about this stuff, but when you get 10% of profits as a creator when using a publisher, you have to sell a whole lot of books, and I know that there are many creators out there who sell more books than I do but are poorer 'cause of the way the system works. But again, I may jump in once I feel it's safe hehe ;)


As a print publisher, I've heard that Image Comics has some kind of different system than I think almost any publisher uses. All of their books are creator-owned, which is why they seem to be releasing brand new titles almost every single month. While I'm not privvy to the exact details of how it works, I've been told that there's some sort of buy-in cost to the creators for start-up costs on launching a new title.

In effect, you the owner of the property are paying Image Comics as a "publishing service" for handling things like accounting, printing, advertising & promotion, editorial services, distribution. Once the book is launched, if it makes a certain minimum sales, then you the owner get a much larger percentage of the profit than would be the case with other publishers, but retain 100% ownership and control.

Just having the Image logo on a title and being under their aegis for solicitation purposes seems give a comic more notice and opportunity for serious consideration by potential readers in the current marketplace (ironic, I know, considering what they started out publishing, and in a few cases, still do). Not trying to sell anyone on the idea, because I don't know anyone who works there, but the concept sounds intriguing to me, if that situation as it exists is what I've been told it is.
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Gisele on July 04, 2016, 06:16:04 pm
Quote from: DeCarlo Rules on July 04, 2016, 01:20:31 am
Quote from: Gisele on June 28, 2016, 10:10:36 pm
My issue was more about losing existing sales to Amazon. Current buyers might prefer to go to Amazon 'cause they can get free shipping and bundle it up with something else. If I get too many of those, I almost have to sell double what I do now to make up for it. If I don't sell double, I'm losing. Sure, I might get more sales, but that doesn't mean more money. In any case, like I said, I'm considering it. I'm just very slow at doing this 'cause, well, I do everything myself for the most part, and have a lot of the go. It's no surprise people like to use publishers to put out their work as they don't have to worry about this stuff, but when you get 10% of profits as a creator when using a publisher, you have to sell a whole lot of books, and I know that there are many creators out there who sell more books than I do but are poorer 'cause of the way the system works. But again, I may jump in once I feel it's safe hehe ;)


As a print publisher, I've heard that Image Comics has some kind of different system than I think almost any publisher uses. All of their books are creator-owned, which is why they seem to be releasing brand new titles almost every single month. While I'm not privvy to the exact details of how it works, I've been told that there's some sort of buy-in cost to the creators for start-up costs on launching a new title.

In effect, you the owner of the property are paying Image Comics as a "publishing service" for handling things like accounting, printing, advertising & promotion, editorial services, distribution. Once the book is launched, if it makes a certain minimum sales, then you the owner get a much larger percentage of the profit than would be the case with other publishers, but retain 100% ownership and control.

Just having the Image logo on a title and being under their aegis for solicitation purposes seems give a comic more notice and opportunity for serious consideration by potential readers in the current marketplace (ironic, I know, considering what they started out publishing, and in a few cases, still do). Not trying to sell anyone on the idea, because I don't know anyone who works there, but the concept sounds intriguing to me, if that situation as it exists is what I've been told it is.


I may eventually try Image for a project. Here are some interesting reads in that regard btw:
http://www.jimzub.com/the-reality-of-mainstream-creator-owned-comics/
http://www.jimzub.com/creator-owned-economics-the-changing-market/
Title: Re: Magick Chicks returns (w/Dan Parent)
Post by: Jughead on July 04, 2016, 07:19:35 pm
Wassup Gisele ;)
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